MKIV S/U

[Julian]

I understand what you are saying RBT but there are many circumstances when fishing for large carp that 12lb line is not enough. Its irrelevant what reel you have if a large carp surges off to a snag only a few feet away. If you give it any line it buries in the snags and is lost in seconds. If you stop it on 12lb line in those circumstances it will continue and break the line also in a few seconds.The reason the line breaks in these circumstances is that it is often being pulled at an angle against branches or thick lily stems/roots, so abrasion takes place.
I would be very interested to know how you would overcome this problem simply because you are fishing with a centrepin,and if you do actually fish for large carp on the surface in very snaggy swims.

I used to think a 'pin was better for those life-and-death battles, but find in practice, a tough fixed spool, clutch set hard down, is more useful for shortening line in a hurry.

As you say Julian, once line gets around any kind of snag, it runs the risk of being abraded, but even if not abraded, the line passing over the snag removes the flex and shock absorption of the rod from the equation - often this is where the hook-hold goes. Its probably how fish seem to transfer hooks to branches - once the line is around said branch, the rod can't cushion the pull on the hook, out it comes and then being pulled around the branch by a straightening rod will stick the hook in it three times out of four.

In any event, stopping a fish requires the ability to absorb enough shock as the fish is decelerated, to prevent the strain on the line exceeding it's breaking strain. A softer rod introduces a lower deceleration to a moving fish, than a stiff one, keeping the strain on the line lower. As well as this, a softer rod shortens more than the stiffer rod (for the same length of rod) and this in turn allow you to put more pressure on a fish, as you can exert more force (parallelogram of forces).

Other factors come into play as well. I've had my line snapped a couple of times surface fishing at about 30-40 yards, by a 'crash-diving carp' - the line snapped with only the slightest tug on the rod - the surface tension of the water on a length of line essentially removed the rod from the equation.

Even with appropriate (strong) tackle, a force applied quickly enough can lead to the strain on the line exceeding the breaking strain before the inertia of the rod is overcome - if a large fish hits a bait 'on the run' and really snatches at it, this can happen. It's why, if fishing by snags, it is best to pile into the fish the moment it takes. It's safer to get it under the control of the rod's shock absorption, before it gets up any speed.

Having skull-dragged 'a few' large doubles in smallish swims, what worked best is a slow-action but powerful rod and the strongest line that does the job. It's why, hanging behind me, is a non-cane 10 foot 'stalking rod' made from the top two sections of a Bruce and Walker 15 foot 10-12aftm Salmon rod.

Agree totally with most of what you are saying JAA, and I'm pleased that your second paragraph confirms my views of how hooks that were in a carp's mouth end up embedded in a branch or tree/lily root.

[JAA]

I understand what you are saying RBT but there are many circumstances when fishing for large carp that 12lb line is not enough. Its irrelevant what reel you have if a large carp surges off to a snag only a few feet away. If you give it any line it buries in the snags and is lost in seconds. If you stop it on 12lb line in those circumstances it will continue and break the line also in a few seconds.The reason the line breaks in these circumstances is that it is often being pulled at an angle against branches or thick lily stems/roots, so abrasion takes place.
I would be very interested to know how you would overcome this problem simply because you are fishing with a centrepin,and if you do actually fish for large carp on the surface in very snaggy swims.

I used to think a 'pin was better for those life-and-death battles, but find in practice, a tough fixed spool, clutch set hard down, is more useful for shortening line in a hurry.

As you say Julian, once line gets around any kind of snag, it runs the risk of being abraded, but even if not abraded, the line passing over the snag removes the flex and shock absorption of the rod from the equation - often this is where the hook-hold goes. Its probably how fish seem to transfer hooks to branches - once the line is around said branch, the rod can't cushion the pull on the hook, out it comes and then being pulled around the branch by a straightening rod will stick the hook in it three times out of four.

In any event, stopping a fish requires the ability to absorb enough shock as the fish is decelerated, to prevent the strain on the line exceeding it's breaking strain. A softer rod introduces a lower deceleration to a moving fish, than a stiff one, keeping the strain on the line lower. As well as this, a softer rod shortens more than the stiffer rod (for the same length of rod) and this in turn allow you to put more pressure on a fish, as you can exert more force (parallelogram of forces).

Other factors come into play as well. I've had my line snapped a couple of times surface fishing at about 30-40 yards, by a 'crash-diving carp' - the line snapped with only the slightest tug on the rod - the surface tension of the water on a length of line essentially removed the rod from the equation.

Even with appropriate (strong) tackle, a force applied quickly enough can lead to the strain on the line exceeding the breaking strain before the inertia of the rod is overcome - if a large fish hits a bait 'on the run' and really snatches at it, this can happen. It's why, if fishing by snags, it is best to pile into the fish the moment it takes. It's safer to get it under the control of the rod's shock absorption, before it gets up any speed.

Having skull-dragged 'a few' large doubles in smallish swims, what worked best is a slow-action but powerful rod and the strongest line that does the job. It's why, hanging behind me, is a non-cane 10 foot 'stalking rod' made from the top two sections of a Bruce and Walker 15 foot 10-12aftm Salmon rod.

Agree totally with most of what you are saying JAA, and I'm pleased that your second paragraph confirms my views of how hooks that were in a carp's mouth end up embedded in a branch or tree/lily root.

Ah, not just me then I'm something of an expert at retrieving hooks from blackthorn bushes behind me as well

I should have added that if I'm figurativly 'loading for bear' I use thick wire hooks as well, sizes 6 and 4, Korda Wide Gape X or XX. No point in using strong gear if it just rips out the hook.

[Jeremy Croxall]

I have removed black anodising with Jenolite, took about 24 hrs fully immersed.

[Paul D]

I have removed black anodising with Jenolite, took about 24 hrs fully immersed.

[Jeremy Croxall]

I have removed black anodising with Jenolite, took about 24 hrs fully immersed.

Refers to the red reel bands, anodising can be removed with Jenolite rust remover to return them to the natural aluminium colour. I did this with a black anodised butt cap.