Speedia Wide reel arbor: final call

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Chavender
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Re: Speedia Wide reel arbor: final call

Post by Chavender » Mon Dec 10, 2018 10:52 pm

i'm not knocking 3D printed ones ,what I've come up with ,isn't even close in looks ,but it is effective and if I was to compare on cost for the price of going to a local 3D printers and ordering just a one off ,I could make a couple dozen or more for around the same price ,for the cost of materials of say £7-£8 I could not just do many centrepins but other spools too (altex /deep Mitchell etc) .my solution allows for the build up of the arbor to that desired ,in this case we're talking speedias the standard drum is effectively 2"5/8th (67mm) and a arbor depth of 20mm (6/8th) to shallow it to 6mm or so and with 50m or so line and increased retrieval rates as the circumference is increased to 11" of line per rotation) instead of a little over 8" per turn .and for negligible increase in weight ,to get a 3D printed arbor with a thickness of 14mm to create a shallow spooled speedia would probably double the cost or more .So its more expensive to get to the same point plus the solid plastic must add weight .as I said the 3D printed ones are superior in looks and fitting ,although mine can be done better than I've done them in my guide ,colour choice etc .mine isn't in competition ,just a alternative method not limited too centrepins .


the black cat should be very close too a standard speedia .
I try to be funny... but sometimes I merely look it! Steve

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MacMan
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Re: Speedia Wide reel arbor: final call

Post by MacMan » Tue Dec 11, 2018 12:28 am

Mitch300 wrote:
Mon Dec 10, 2018 4:11 am
Hello Matt (MacMan),

It's great to see that your Speedia arbour is so successful, and that you are diversifying into one for a Grice and Young. I went through quite a few iterations on an arbour for the C340 Match Aerial. I first tried to make 12 identical pieces to slot between the 12 posts, as Watermole did from a perspex disk on a lathe, but I couldn't achieve tight enough tolerances on the 3-D printer. Some were too big and some too small. I guess the shrinkage during cooling is too variable. Instead, I went with a 4-piece arbour, extending 1/32" beyond the outside of each pillar. A few turns of line keep the four pieces in place. I thought I would post images of it as part of this thread, since it is where the expertise lies, and in a few days time begin a new thread for it, with the files attached, under the Allcocks section.



G. B.
Hi mate, nice to see someone else having a crack. My Grice and Young arbour seems to work quite nicely. Great to see so many people have found ways to make the arbours successfully. I did my Speedia one simply because I had a 3D printer already and it was a nice project. I haven't made a cent out of them BTW, I only do it for fun. I will be putting the GY arbour into the public domain for anyone to print, I just need to see if I can remove prototype and see if it will fit a Gypsy D'or/Avon Royal 3/Shakespeare Eagle.

Matt

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MacMan
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Re: Speedia Wide reel arbor: final call

Post by MacMan » Tue Dec 11, 2018 12:34 am

Chavender wrote:
Mon Dec 10, 2018 10:52 pm
i'm not knocking 3D printed ones ,what I've come up with ,isn't even close in looks ,but it is effective and if I was to compare on cost for the price of going to a local 3D printers and ordering just a one off ,I could make a couple dozen or more for around the same price ,for the cost of materials of say £7-£8 I could not just do many centrepins but other spools too (altex /deep Mitchell etc) .my solution allows for the build up of the arbor to that desired ,in this case we're talking speedias the standard drum is effectively 2"5/8th (67mm) and a arbor depth of 20mm (6/8th) to shallow it to 6mm or so and with 50m or so line and increased retrieval rates as the circumference is increased to 11" of line per rotation) instead of a little over 8" per turn .and for negligible increase in weight ,to get a 3D printed arbor with a thickness of 14mm to create a shallow spooled speedia would probably double the cost or more .So its more expensive to get to the same point plus the solid plastic must add weight .as I said the 3D printed ones are superior in looks and fitting ,although mine can be done better than I've done them in my guide ,colour choice etc .mine isn't in competition ,just a alternative method not limited too centrepins .


the black cat should be very close too a standard speedia .
Just to clarify one thing about 3D printing, the arbour isn't solid for a standard desktop 3D printer. In fact, you can change the infill amount to whatever you want within reason. The internals of the ones I make are 20%, this keeps the weight down. Quite often when you go to a commercial 3D printer they use a sintering printer which prints a solid block of plastic. Hopefully with 3D printing becoming more commonplace it will become cheaper to get things like this made over time.

Matt

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Stathamender
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Re: Speedia Wide reel arbor: final call

Post by Stathamender » Tue Dec 11, 2018 10:17 am

MacMan wrote:
Tue Dec 11, 2018 12:34 am

Just to clarify one thing about 3D printing, the arbour isn't solid for a standard desktop 3D printer. In fact, you can change the infill amount to whatever you want within reason. The internals of the ones I make are 20%, this keeps the weight down. Quite often when you go to a commercial 3D printer they use a sintering printer which prints a solid block of plastic. Hopefully with 3D printing becoming more commonplace it will become cheaper to get things like this made over time.

Matt
Both commercial printers I used for the Speedia arbours offered optional infill amounts (can't remember what I chose). As it was my first time doing anything like this I just went for the easiest and cheapest option. If I did this again I would probably use Macman's 20% option (if only to reduce costs and production time) but even with a solid plastic arbor the percentage increase in weight on something like a Speedia wide is going to be very minimal. I didn't experiment with changing numbers to see if there were any advantages from a larger print run (other than reducing the part of the price that is down to setup costs as these were only about 20p per unit anyway). This is essentially a bespoke method where costs are going to be relatively inelastic, I think if one was looking at bulk production one would use something like injection moulding with the 3D print as a prototype for the actual mould. But there aren't enough Speedias in the entire world to justify that so, unless a low cost, home workshop, means of doing this emerges then it's not going to happen and 3D print is all we can do. One of the advantages of 3D is that it has a very low scrappage rate so it's fairly easy to produce a limited run for a fixed amount, another is that commercial 3D is now fairly widespread and it's easy, using something like the 3D Hubs site, to find a supplier either near you or who will deliver.

Let's recall how this got started: there was a discussion of Speedia arbors and most of the methods proposed seemed a bit of a faff to me. Someone mentioned MacMan's designs and I thought 'I wonder if this could be done in Sheffield?' It could and so I did it. I didn't make any money either, buyers got them at cost price. A cost of c £4.50 per hardly seems expensive to me, the P&P was more than that, and how many reels have you got that you a) actually use and b) need one of these things for anyway? When there are finalised G&Y and Match Aerial designs I may do it for those as well.

NB I will be in the UK for a slightly longer period than usual this winter, probably right up to the end of March (wouldn't want to miss out on all the fun in the lead-up to the 29th) so it will be easier for me to arrange any more arbor print runs. Watch this space.

I look forward to reading the details of Chavender's method and I will continue to use bike handle tape where necessary.
Iain

'You may say I'm a dreamer but I am not the only one.......'

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Olly
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Re: Speedia Wide reel arbor: final call

Post by Olly » Tue Dec 11, 2018 10:54 am

Everyone who owns a Speedia - wide or narrow - would benefit from the arbour. At the price it was produced at it was superb and I can only thank those involved in its inception and production.

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Shaun Harrison
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Re: Speedia Wide reel arbor: final call

Post by Shaun Harrison » Tue Dec 11, 2018 11:45 am

I wish I had been quicker off the mark. Should another run of them happen...

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Stathamender
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Re: Speedia Wide reel arbor: final call

Post by Stathamender » Tue Dec 11, 2018 3:50 pm

Shaun Harrison wrote:
Tue Dec 11, 2018 11:45 am
I wish I had been quicker off the mark. Should another run of them happen...
I will make an announcement soon.
Iain

'You may say I'm a dreamer but I am not the only one.......'

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Chavender
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Re: Speedia Wide reel arbor: final call

Post by Chavender » Wed Dec 12, 2018 12:26 am

I've posted My take on building centrepin / spool arbor fillers ,layered Skinz in the reel guides section ,as I said its a alternative method of producing either single layer covering the line lay bars or deep drums ,that can be built up in layers to alter line capacity and maybe increase retrieval rates a little bit .with out any spool weight gained .and not just for centrepins but all suitable spools .

these are not in competition for the moulded 3D printed ones offered here ,just a alternative method of achieving the same thing .a shallower spool with out the kinking of lines you sometimes get with speedia's and other reels .I just posted about it here as my reason for coming up with the skinz method was for my mk1 speedia and its 8 line lay bars that really puts the kink into kinky lines .

if you want a great looking arbor then get a 3D one when available ,they really are great .and for what they are ,a great price .I've never given the price charged any thought other than compared to materials costs ,Stathamender prices are great but none of my business so don't get a second thought . he's a great TFF'er who I respect .like I said my method is not copmpetition ,just a cheap alternative if your reel isn't yet covered by a 3d arbor .or is a none centrepin spool .

see for yourselfs ,if its good or not ,posted in the relavent how too guides section
viewtopic.php?f=452&p=385834#p385834
I try to be funny... but sometimes I merely look it! Steve

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MacMan
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Re: Speedia Wide reel arbor: final call

Post by MacMan » Wed Dec 12, 2018 9:39 am

It's all good mate, and thanks for posting up the details, I like the corflute approach.

Matt

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ExiledSoutherner
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Re: Speedia Wide reel arbor: final call

Post by ExiledSoutherner » Sat Mar 30, 2019 10:42 am

Ah - it looks as though I've missed out on this one. I've recently had my wide-drum Deluxe fixed by Garry Mills, and need an arbor, though not desperately. Bah humbug! :oops:

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