The famous lift method - Size of float and shot

This forum is for discussing the Lift Method.
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Reedling
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Re: The famous lift method - Size of float and shot

Post by Reedling »

[/quote]
I wish I knew where one could find decent float rubbers these days most of those available are plastic which soon splits. I won't get into the argument about lift floats being fished over depth and pulled back to cock. Increasingly what I find is that too many still waters are too weedy for fishing the lift method.
[/quote]

Cycle valve rubber may be what you are after, bike shop or a well known auction site may have some.

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Surrey Martin
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Re: The famous lift method - Size of float and shot

Post by Surrey Martin »

Hey all
Please see a reply I sent recently to a similar query on the lift method
xcuse me for confusing the issue but my u derstanding is that the method you are referring to is Laying On whereas the lift method is different in that the float is set up bottom end and enough bulk shot to nearly cock the float ( I use drennan Driftbeater ) then a tell tale shot BB is placed about 1inch from hook and rests lightly just on the bottom so accurate plumbing is required . Once set up the float will be cocked correctly but as soon as a fish takes or mouths the bait then the tell tale will be be disturbed and the float lifts .When a fish bites I was always told not to strike until the float disappears completely . Something that is very hard to do when a fish is running about with it but it does work and striking before does not hook the fish which of course is hopefully a large tench .
Anyway that’s my interpretation and I think Peter Stones book Gravel Pit Angling Des rives the method
Cheers
Martin

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Reedling
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Re: The famous lift method - Size of float and shot

Post by Reedling »

The first float that is illustrated in the book 'About floats', Fishing Gazette, is showing the lift method to a tee. A 2 1/2" quill is used with just a BB shot sat on the bottom to cock it at dead depth, with a short hook link. When the bait is lifted off the bottom so the float lifts. This dates to November 1904.

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Stathamender
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Re: The famous lift method - Size of float and shot

Post by Stathamender »

Reedling wrote: Sat Aug 04, 2018 7:40 pm
I wish I knew where one could find decent float rubbers these days most of those available are plastic which soon splits. I won't get into the argument about lift floats being fished over depth and pulled back to cock. Increasingly what I find is that too many still waters are too weedy for fishing the lift method.


Cycle valve rubber may be what you are after, bike shop or a well known auction site may have some.
Ask for valve rubber in a cycle shop (as I have) and you will be laughed at. Modern tubes simply don't need it. There's a certain amount around I'm told for people who restore old bikes but it's difficult to find. Any way the diameter is too small usually for e.g. the top of an Avon and it soon splits under the strain. I've also tried using pellet bands but agin they break too easily.
Iain

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Michael
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Re: The famous lift method - Size of float and shot

Post by Michael »

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Last edited by Michael on Tue Aug 20, 2019 9:12 am, edited 2 times in total.

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Olly
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Re: The famous lift method - Size of float and shot

Post by Olly »

There is one very good silicon rubber tubing supplier - on eBay.

From 0.5 to 5.0 mm - in various lengths - various colours - eight in fact. At £2.00 per m!

Tubing for line/fish protection to float rubbers!

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Stathamender
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Re: The famous lift method - Size of float and shot

Post by Stathamender »

Olly wrote: Sun Aug 05, 2018 1:11 pm There is one very good silicon rubber tubing supplier - on eBay.

From 0.5 to 5.0 mm - in various lengths - various colours - eight in fact. At £2.00 per m!

Tubing for line/fish protection to float rubbers!
I've tried a search there but it didn't come up. All I can find is stuff either for ultra thin pole floats or carp rigs, both too thin. I'll try again.
Iain

What is your favourite word?
I suspect it could be “love”, despite its drawbacks in the rhyming department.
Björn Ulvaeus

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Olly
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Re: The famous lift method - Size of float and shot

Post by Olly »

PM on it's way - cant tell everyone - might sell out!

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Santiago
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Re: The famous lift method - Size of float and shot

Post by Santiago »

Lighter things floating on denser things is a simple explanation of a more complex situation. Because it's the bit of a floating object that is under the surface that makes it all interesting. The heavier the float the more is under the surface and this part equals in weight the volume of displaced water and the weight of the whole float. Therefore a neutrally buoyant float will be fully submerged but will not sink unless a separate force acts on it. Yet with a very light float most of it will be above the waterline and will need the weight of shot equivalent to the above water line float volume to make it neutrally buoyant. Also, the part of the light float below the waterline is subject to an upthrust force equivalent to the weight of water displaced which is the same as the total weight of the float. So when an independent force further submerges the light float beyond it's normal waterline, there's an additional upthrust force which alters depending on how far the float sinks. Once it sinks fully the total upthrust force is equivalent to the total volume of displaced water (volume of the float). There's also upthrust acting on the weight, which again is equivalent to the volume displaced. Thus, even things that weigh heavier than the liquid they're in experience upthrust. We do this experiment at school in prep science it's that basic! Simply get a spring balance and attach a heavy stone using string and weight it in air and then in water. You'll find it weighs much less in water. The difference is due to upthrust. I should also add that the term upthrust is also a bit of a misnomer. Because upthrust doesn't just act upwards. The force is multi directional acting at all angles on the surface of any submerged object but not on surfaces above the waterline. So the overall force is upwards, even though quite a bit will be sideways, and in complicated designs some will be downwards, even so, the less dense object will be pushed upwards but will have a more stable buoyancy (eg., a bodied waggler or an avon trotter) because the thrust is acting in many directions. That's why the shape of the float matters when applied to the lift method. The simple waggler shape being the optimal since there's no downthrust and very little drag to reduce the upthrust on the float when the bait /weight is picked up by a biting fish.
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AshbyCut
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Re: The famous lift method - Size of float and shot

Post by AshbyCut »

The first three are scans of the description of the 'lift method' taken from "Freshwater Fishing" by Falkus and Buller ...

ImageImageImageI hope these images help ...

... and the next two are illustrations from "Tench" by Fred Taylor ...

ImageImage

May I also recommend pages 88 to 96 (a section entitled 'The lift method') in "Catching Carp and Tench" by John Wilson.
"Beside the water I discovered (or maybe rediscovered) the quiet. The sort of quiet that allows one to be woven into the tapestry of nature instead of merely standing next to it." Estaban.

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