Question Regarding Intrepid Elite Variations

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Chas
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Question Regarding Intrepid Elite Variations

Post by Chas » Wed Jul 15, 2015 3:06 pm

Greetings All

I recently got an Intrepid Elite from eBay for the princely sum of £4.95 more than anything; just for old times sake if only to put on the shelf. After a clean and service, it turned out to be pretty good on all counts and still suitable for use.

I bought a second one, this time for 99p just for spares. My first was missing the black plastic cap that goes on the drive shaft opposite the handle and I wanted a spare spool. At less that a fiver including postage, I figured the spare spool was worth that.

Anyway the question: the bright-work my first one has a nice satin aluminium look to the finish with no signs of corrosion but the second one had bright-work that looked more like a chrome finish. I suspect that the chrome has been applied to a poor grade metal like Mazak because it is pitted like old Vauxhall Victor door handles. Also the bail-arm mechanisms are totally different. The first had a small plunger under the bail arm pivot assembly but the second one has a release button on the rotor housing. Both incidentally have the plastic main gear.

Anybody know anything about the history?

Cheers

Chas

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Stingray
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Re: Question Regarding Intrepid Elite Variations

Post by Stingray » Thu Jul 16, 2015 1:44 pm

A tricky question you pose us all regarding not just the Elite but all K.P. Morritt reels, Chas. I'm not aware of anyone yet managing to put all the variations into what I would consider a convincing date order and much of the information on the Web (as with many things) is an almost untanglable mixture of unsubstantiated opinion (which may or may not be accurate) and substantiated fact (hopefully). Even much top level detail such as production start and end dates is not known - or not in any way that convinces me personally. Regarding the Elite, I've been meaning to spend some time looking into the changes timeline but right now all I can say with reasonable certainty is that the metal gear was a later improvement on the plastic.

:tea:
Last edited by Stingray on Thu Jul 16, 2015 3:11 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Question Regarding Intrepid Elite Variations

Post by Kevanf1 » Thu Jul 16, 2015 2:59 pm

The very first iterations had the bail arm that folded right back. I think this carried on into the second version but was dropped in the third one. I think, but as always stand to be corrected, that there were 4 different versions of the Elite. Some parts are interchangeable while others are not :(
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Chas
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Re: Question Regarding Intrepid Elite Variations

Post by Chas » Thu Jul 16, 2015 3:35 pm

Hi Gents

The bail arms on both of mine do fold right back.

Regarding parts not being interchangeable, I've already found that the anti-reverse mechanism in the second one I bought is different to the first and I can't yet get it to work. I only really bought the second for spares but the body and rotor are in quite good condition and apart from the anti-reverse it works OK so might try to resurrect it. The handle and drag not are scruffy and the handle assembly is loose on the drive shaft (it makes it feel like there is a load of backlash in the gears). It is definitely the handle that's at fault because I've tried swapping them over and the good handle from my first reel is a good fit.

Just bought another one to play with.

Cheers

Chas

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Re: Question Regarding Intrepid Elite Variations

Post by AshbyCut » Thu Jul 16, 2015 7:32 pm

Remember that the 'anti-reverse' mechanism has 3 positions ... not two ! That confuses some ... as I know to my cost. :Brickwall:
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Re: Question Regarding Intrepid Elite Variations

Post by Chas » Mon Jul 20, 2015 2:25 pm

Hi Gents

My third one turned up today and it's different again. The bail arm pivot assembly is different to my previous ones but it does have a similar plunger to release the bail arm. The bail arm does again fold flat. I think this must be a late version as it does have the metal gear but the overall quality of finish looks far poorer than my others.

The paint has a far more glossy finish but the finish quality is not anything as good as the other two. My first impression was that it had been given a poor re-spray but there's no sign of the name plate or oil port ever being masked or removed. If someone had gone to that trouble, they would never settled for that quality of finish. I think the latest reel is actually a near mint example of an Intrepid Elite made after "quality control" fell by the wayside.

There are also flaws in the casting of both the body and rotor.

The folding handle has a distinct "casting seam" down the outside edge where on the previous ones, it looks like this has been polished out before final finishing.

So, to set the ball rolling and assuming there were four different versions as mentioned before, this is what I've gleaned so far from the three I've got and what I've seen in pictures (here and eBay etc):

Version 1: Hourglass shaped handle, no other details known.

Version 2: Release "switch" on rotor for bail arm, bail arm folds flat, nylon gears, chrome type finish to bright-work which appears well finished but all seen are now pitted, body and rotor castings look good, good eggshell finish to paintwork, nameplate has PAT No 798,024 written on diagonal below "Elite".

Version 3: Redesigned bail arm pivot assembly with plunger release, bail arm still folds flat, nylon gears, satin aluminium type finish to bright-work which appears well finished and none seen appear to be pitted, body and rotor castings look good, good eggshell finish to paintwork, nameplate has PAT No 798,024 written on horizontal above MADE IN ENGLAND.

Version 4: Slightly larger bail arm pivot assembly that above but still with plunger release, bail arm still folds flat, metal gears, satin aluminium type finish to bright-work but not as well finished as above and none seen appear to be pitted, body and rotor castings look poorer than above, quite poor almost gloss finish to paintwork, nameplate has PAT No 798,024 written on horizontal above MADE IN ENGLAND.

OK, this is only based on three reels on my desk and views of pictures on the internet and I don't suppose I've found a fraction of it yet. These are findings and observations only and I'm not claiming anything as a production "fact"

I'd be interested if anyone can add to this or even confirm my thoughts.

Cheers

Chas

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Re: Question Regarding Intrepid Elite Variations

Post by Chas » Mon Jul 20, 2015 3:46 pm

Just found a picture of another that looks like a potential fifth version
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Stingray
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Re: Question Regarding Intrepid Elite Variations

Post by Stingray » Mon Jul 20, 2015 4:10 pm

Chas wrote:Hi Gents

My third one turned up today and it's different again. The bail arm pivot assembly is different to my previous ones but it does have a similar plunger to release the bail arm. The bail arm does again fold flat. I think this must be a late version as it does have the metal gear but the overall quality of finish looks far poorer than my others.

The paint has a far more glossy finish but the finish quality is not anything as good as the other two. My first impression was that it had been given a poor re-spray but there's no sign of the name plate or oil port ever being masked or removed. If someone had gone to that trouble, they would never settled for that quality of finish. I think the latest reel is actually a near mint example of an Intrepid Elite made after "quality control" fell by the wayside.

There are also flaws in the casting of both the body and rotor.

The folding handle has a distinct "casting seam" down the outside edge where on the previous ones, it looks like this has been polished out before final finishing.

So, to set the ball rolling and assuming there were four different versions as mentioned before, this is what I've gleaned so far from the three I've got and what I've seen in pictures (here and eBay etc):

Version 1: Hourglass shaped handle, no other details known.

Version 2: Release "switch" on rotor for bail arm, bail arm folds flat, nylon gears, chrome type finish to bright-work which appears well finished but all seen are now pitted, body and rotor castings look good, good eggshell finish to paintwork, nameplate has PAT No 798,024 written on diagonal below "Elite".

Version 3: Redesigned bail arm pivot assembly with plunger release, bail arm still folds flat, nylon gears, satin aluminium type finish to bright-work which appears well finished and none seen appear to be pitted, body and rotor castings look good, good eggshell finish to paintwork, nameplate has PAT No 798,024 written on horizontal above MADE IN ENGLAND.

Version 4: Slightly larger bail arm pivot assembly that above but still with plunger release, bail arm still folds flat, metal gears, satin aluminium type finish to bright-work but not as well finished as above and none seen appear to be pitted, body and rotor castings look poorer than above, quite poor almost gloss finish to paintwork, nameplate has PAT No 798,024 written on horizontal above MADE IN ENGLAND.

OK, this is only based on three reels on my desk and views of pictures on the internet and I don't suppose I've found a fraction of it yet. These are findings and observations only and I'm not claiming anything as a production "fact"

I'd be interested if anyone can add to this or even confirm my thoughts.

Cheers

Chas
I'd say that the one conspicuously missing ftrom your list for me (though as you say there will be others) is the be a metal gear version with similar finish to 1,2, and 3 in your list which would sit a 4 and shunt your latest one to 5. The high gloss black and chrome of your last version is consistent with the later transition to the finish that was to become standard in all the "new" Intrepids such as the Prince Regent, New Deluxe, Extra, Challenger and Super Twin. Also, a move towards different (maybe cheaper & faster perhaps ?) production techniques and finishes does not necessarily equate to "quality control fell by the wayside" and may or may not result in lower actual quality - for example, I personally prefer the earlier more classic look and feel finishes but have observed that many of the "new" batch I've listed have proven their worth by lasting the course.

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Re: Question Regarding Intrepid Elite Variations

Post by Chas » Mon Jul 20, 2015 5:08 pm

Thanks Stingray!

We're moving forward so 've done a revision:

Version 1: Hourglass shaped handle, no other details known. From pictures I've seen, the rest looks like version 2.

Version 2: Release "switch" on rotor for bail arm, bail arm folds flat, nylon gears, chrome type finish to bright-work which appears well finished but all seen are now pitted, body and rotor castings look good, good eggshell finish to paintwork, nameplate has PAT No 798,024 written on diagonal below "Elite".

Version 3: Redesigned bail arm pivot assembly with plunger release, bail arm still folds flat, nylon gears, satin aluminium type finish to bright-work which appears well finished and none seen appear to be pitted, body and rotor castings look good, good eggshell finish to paintwork, nameplate has PAT No 798,024 written on horizontal above MADE IN ENGLAND.

Version 4: Metal gear but other details as above.

Version 5: Slightly larger bail arm pivot assembly that above but still with plunger release, bail arm still folds flat, metal gears, satin aluminium type finish to bright-work but not as well finished as above and none seen appear to be pitted, body and rotor castings look poorer than above, quite poor almost gloss finish to paintwork, nameplate has PAT No 798,024 written on horizontal above MADE IN ENGLAND.

Version 6: Generally as above but with flattened winding handle as photo and what appears to be a chrome finish to bright-work.

OK, If the glossy finished one I'm holding in my hand at present isn't "lower actual quality" (but it looks pretty rough to me), it would certainly have made me want to buy a Mitchell 300 or ABU. My reasoning would be if they took that little care of the outside, why would I think they would take more care of the internal mechanism?

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Re: Question Regarding Intrepid Elite Variations

Post by Paul D » Mon Jul 20, 2015 5:23 pm

So mine is a first version??? Image
Hour glass handle, pat number under "Elite", egg shell finish.
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