Army and Navy Cooperative Society brass winch

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Duckett
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Army and Navy Cooperative Society brass winch

Post by Duckett » Sun Sep 08, 2019 2:15 pm

Cleaning out his father in laws garden shed, my brother came across this little 3 inch brass winch:

ImageImageImageImage

The address: 105 Victoria Street, Westminster, immediately told me it was Army & Navy Cooperative Society Limited. As I’ve never handling a brass winch before, I decided to have a fettle.

Sadly, the foot has been neatly filed down at some stage but everything else seemed original. Unscrewing the three pillars and foot was remarkably easy:

ImageImageImage

However, nothing, not even unscrewing the 2 screws in the central boss, allowed me to release the plate the winding handle is attached to and get to the ratchet mechanism.

Now, I don’t want to clean and polish such an old reel, I rather like the patina of old brass. I’ll probably simply put it on display but I do rather fancy giving her a try on one of my older rods with brass reel bands for a spot of stillwater float fishing. So, I wonder if anyone can help with a few questions:

1) Just how can I get to the ratchet mechanism to lubricate her?
2) Would strong braid backing work if I want to fill that deep spool enough to accommodate a hundred yards if mono?
3) Does anyone have any idea who made these winches for the Army and Navy? So far, all the winches with 3 pillars I have seen on-line have been Farlow’s or Hardy.
4) I’m assuming she is late 19th Century in date. As most look very similar, I assume that’s the closest dating that can be managed. Am I correct?

Many thanks,

Phil :Hat:
From "... the wilds of the Wirral, whose wayward people both God and good men have quite given up on ...".

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Harry H
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Re: Army and Navy Cooperative Society brass winch

Post by Harry H » Sun Sep 08, 2019 4:31 pm

Hi Phil
If it has a hole in the spool spindle just place a nail or something similar through it and unwind the handle while holding the nail to stop the spindle from turning, hopefully it will come undone as easy as the other bits.

These reels would have been for trout fishing and were still being sold in the 1920s, the A & N store was open 1902 - 1939..
:Hat:
There are three things that improve with age: wine, friendship and water sense, and there's no short cut.
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Thameside
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Re: Army and Navy Cooperative Society brass winch

Post by Thameside » Sun Sep 08, 2019 5:15 pm

The Army & Navy store was still open in the 90's as used to shop there. After a quick search it was taken over by House of Fraser. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Army_%2 ... d_Kingdom)
Also the one in Lewisham is where the new police station has been built

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Duckett
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Re: Army and Navy Cooperative Society brass winch

Post by Duckett » Sun Sep 08, 2019 6:09 pm

Harry H wrote:
Sun Sep 08, 2019 4:31 pm
Hi Phil
If it has a hole in the spool spindle just place a nail or something similar through it and unwind the handle while holding the nail to stop the spindle from turning, hopefully it will come undone as easy as the other bits.

These reels would have been for trout fishing and were still being sold in the 1920s, the A & N store was open 1902 - 1939..
:Hat:
Thanks Harry, I shall give that a go. I had not taken much notice of brass winches before and had o lot seen pre-WW1 dates ascribed to them! Also I had always assumed that the Army and Navy was a lot older than 1902! The mother of a former girlfriend trained as, of all things, a curtain maker at the Army and Navy! She and her fiends from there always made it sound like an ancient institution!

Fly fishing is out. I’ve tried and failed to learn to cast a fly several times!

Cheers,

Phil
From "... the wilds of the Wirral, whose wayward people both God and good men have quite given up on ...".

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Duckett
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Re: Army and Navy Cooperative Society brass winch

Post by Duckett » Sun Sep 08, 2019 6:12 pm

Thameside wrote:
Sun Sep 08, 2019 5:15 pm
The Army & Navy store was still open in the 90's as used to shop there. After a quick search it was taken over by House of Fraser. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Army_%2 ... d_Kingdom)
Also the one in Lewisham is where the new police station has been built
Thanks Thameside.

Cheers,

Phil
From "... the wilds of the Wirral, whose wayward people both God and good men have quite given up on ...".

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StefanDuma
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Re: Army and Navy Cooperative Society brass winch

Post by StefanDuma » Sun Sep 08, 2019 7:49 pm

OK so first and foremost STOP.

Undo the two retaining screws on the winding plate, then holding the back plate and the spool unscrew the winding plate and that will give you access to the check mechanism.

The reels were made by David Slater of Newark and were sold as Slater's New Style Gun Metal Salmon and Trout Reels in sizes from 2 1/4 to 5 inches.

One of my all time favourite reels retailed by many many people. Introduce by Slater in the late 1891/1892 as far as I am available to trace so far. It is listed in the 1892 catalogue just trying to pinpoint the actual date of launch.

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Duckett
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Re: Army and Navy Cooperative Society brass winch

Post by Duckett » Sun Sep 08, 2019 7:59 pm

Harry H wrote:
Sun Sep 08, 2019 4:31 pm
Hi Phil
If it has a hole in the spool spindle just place a nail or something similar through it and unwind the handle while holding the nail to stop the spindle from turning, hopefully it will come undone as easy as the other bits.

These reels would have been for trout fishing and were still being sold in the 1920s, the A & N store was open 1902 - 1939..
:Hat:
Thanks again Harry. That worked a dream. :Hat:
From "... the wilds of the Wirral, whose wayward people both God and good men have quite given up on ...".

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StefanDuma
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Re: Army and Navy Cooperative Society brass winch

Post by StefanDuma » Wed Sep 11, 2019 3:58 pm

This is a 5 inch version of the reel in Alloy I also have examples in alloy and gun metal combinations. This one retailed by Wyers Freres Redditch and. Paris. It has a hole in the top of the raised check housing for oiling. To access the check mechanism remove the two retaining screws, hold the spool in place by squeezing inner back plate and the back plate and turn counter clockwise.
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Duckett
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Re: Army and Navy Cooperative Society brass winch

Post by Duckett » Wed Sep 11, 2019 4:11 pm

Thanks Stefan. Yes, that worked nicely.

Thanks for the information regarding maker. They are a wonderful piece of engineering in brass.

Once inside it had loads of dust but no sign that anyone had ever lubricated it. I put a dab of grease on the ratchet and put her back together again. sounds lot smoother now.

Out of interest, do you ever use one for fly fishing? I don't fly fish but she appears entirely functional and practical to me.

Cheers,

Phil
From "... the wilds of the Wirral, whose wayward people both God and good men have quite given up on ...".

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StefanDuma
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Re: Army and Navy Cooperative Society brass winch

Post by StefanDuma » Wed Sep 11, 2019 6:41 pm

I did use another variation of the reel an Army & Navy 3 inch gun metal, but with a drag system fitted.

I was ok I used it with a 6ft Hardy split cane rod.

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