The 1st of October

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Shaun Harrison
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Re: The 1st of October

Post by Shaun Harrison » Wed Sep 30, 2015 2:57 pm

Santiago wrote:I don't go by the 1st of October with regard to pike fishing, and have had many good days on the Thames pike fishing with dead baits at night during summer months, but I do however normally fish for them in the winter months. I've never had problems with releasing pike in a healthy condition in the summer but the Thames is a big river and does not suffer from extremes of temperature like many small rivers and small ponds and lakes so is perhaps better oxygenated throughout the summer. However, contrary to popular opinion, the only problems I've had was a deeply hooked 12lb pike caught when lure fishing with a large spoon on a very very cold day in January several years ago. I guess it was so cold the pike made as little effort as it could to catch and swallow the spoon for certainly I did not feel a take but just felt the lure slowly snag the bottom. And what I reeled in was my biggest lure caught pike that came in like a large plastic bag with lots of dead leaves still in it's mouth, and was a very disappointing fight. The point I'm trying to make, is that on very cold days pike can be so lethargic when taking dead baits etc. one has to be quick to strike at even the smallest take no matter what method employed, otherwise one is more likely to deeply hook them compared to warmer winter days or autumn or summer, when most takes are obvious.

So very very cold days in winter also merit caution, possibly more so than most days in the summertime, baring those when there is a heat wave!! For on such cold days they may well just swallow the bait without moving an inch from where they found it. During these cold days I well remember catching several pike that made no indication, I just happened to decide to reel in only to find a fish attached. Perhaps this is another reason why circle hooks are such a good idea.
The River Trent I quoted isn't exactly a small river at 185 miles long with many weirs and being one of the few rivers powerful enough to run up the country (uphill). It is very well oxygenated in the flow but like most rivers has many bays and natural slacks behind bushes etc which become totally de-oxygenated if readings are taken.

As for the pikes more lethargic reactions caused by their cold blooded situation, this is even more reason to be using hair rigs or circle hooks as both methods are pretty poor at hooking the fish anywhere other than the corners of the mouth where the hooks tend to grab hold as the bait is being pulled out.

Treble hooks really should be part of tradition that is slowly put aside and forgotten about in my humble opinion.

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Santiago
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Re: The 1st of October

Post by Santiago » Wed Sep 30, 2015 3:13 pm

Yes, circle hooks etc. are even more important the colder the conditions.

As for parts of rivers being totally de-oxygenated during the summer months, one will not catch pike in these places anyway. One really needs to target weir pools or stretches with good flow, if one wants to catch summer pike safely.
"....he felt the gentle touch on the line and he was happy"

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Shaun Harrison
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Re: The 1st of October

Post by Shaun Harrison » Wed Sep 30, 2015 3:24 pm

Santiago wrote:Yes, circle hooks etc. are even more important the colder the conditions.

As for parts of rivers being totally de-oxygenated during the summer months, one will not catch pike in these places anyway. One really needs to target weir pools or stretches with good flow, if one wants to catch summer pike safely.
Quite an obvious statement really. The problems I had and the reasons I stopped putting them at risk during the warmer months was because I was hooking them in the places you would expect to hook them but forced to land them in the margins which were de-oxygenated. The return then mean't in de-oxygenated water and during the summer months I really don't want to be wearing waders or indeed wading out to return fish. I t was easier to leave them building themselves back up in shape ready for the winter. Summer pike are usually long and lean which to me indicated they possibly took longer to recover from spawning than most species, despite their relatively early spawning.

Everyone to their own I guess, but personally I would rather not risk catching them in the warmer months these days. Interesting fact that most of our predators other than catfish seem to tolerate very little abuse so probably better that most pike, perch and zander fishing is carried out in the cooler more oxygen rich months.

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Tizer
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Re: The 1st of October

Post by Tizer » Wed Sep 30, 2015 3:58 pm

I wanted to reply to santiagos post but I knew what ever I said would not come across as I intended,(lack of education I guess) I night fished every Friday night for years and years summer and winter,In the summer I would try and sit next to my rods and keep awake(even when I had a few beers,)for as long as I could,i seem to remember that any fish we caught at night was always chaoctic,Night fishing for pike is a recipe for disaster IN MY OPINION

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Santiago
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Re: The 1st of October

Post by Santiago » Wed Sep 30, 2015 4:41 pm

I've never had a problem night fishing for pike, when I use to fish at night I was very organised with several pairs of forceps at the ready. Never had a deep hooked pike in the summertime and always debarbed a single small treble hook. Any rig with two hooks is just asking for trouble, especially at night. I should add I caught most at first light, so darkness was not an issue.

The trick to staying awake is plenty of coffee. Most runs in the summertime are screaming and easy to hit quickly, unlike most in winter which can amount to just a small tug at the rod's tip, and if missed can lead to a deeply hooked fish if not using a circle hook.

Ironically, the 1st of October traditionally had nothing to do with fish welfare, quite the opposite as by then pike were considered to be plump enough to be targeted to be taken for the table.

I suspect welfare issues are more complicated than just saying there should be a summer / winter divide. For instance, pike are the first coarse fish to spawn, late February through to March, which gives them plenty of time to recover compared to fish like barbel. And their spawning time coincides with the latter half of winter! Another irony is that traditionally pike were targeted in winter because they were bigger because they are full of spawn, so the lucky angler had better bragging rights over those that caught during the summer.

I am of course playing 'devils advocate ' and for those that read my initial post carefully will have noted I said I do most of my pike fishing during the winter. Nevertheless, I see nothing wrong with pike fishing during summer days /nights when the days have been cloudy or rainy and pretty dam cold, just like this August for example. I'd much rather catch a late summer pike than a spawny one in late February.
"....he felt the gentle touch on the line and he was happy"

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ExeAngler
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Re: The 1st of October

Post by ExeAngler » Thu Oct 01, 2015 12:41 pm

First of October for me. I hope to take my lad for the first time Pike fishing this Sunday afternoon, after Rugby. Bit of lure fishing or sink and draw. Should be exciting stuff.

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Riparian
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Re: The 1st of October

Post by Riparian » Thu Oct 01, 2015 12:46 pm

I thought that I might be the last of the dinosaurs and now I find that there are hundreds of us, thank goodness.

For the record, I went deadbaiting for a couple hours this morning, on the Forty Foot near Chatteris. Despite the east wind, it was unseasonably warm and sunny, and I had precisely no runs. Roll on November...

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Tizer
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Re: The 1st of October

Post by Tizer » Thu Oct 01, 2015 4:34 pm

Riparian wrote:I thought that I might be the last of the dinosaurs and now I find that there are hundreds of us, thank goodness.

For the record, I went deadbaiting for a couple hours this morning, on the Forty Foot near Chatteris. Despite the east wind, it was unseasonably warm and sunny, and I had precisely no runs. Roll on November...
That's where I used to go in the old days,just me and my dogs,boy were they happy days,never saw a soul

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Riparian
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Re: The 1st of October

Post by Riparian » Thu Oct 01, 2015 4:41 pm

Tizer wrote:That's where I used to go in the old days,just me and my dogs,boy were they happy days,never saw a soul
Well, as the man said "Hell is other people". You certainly won't see many anglers on those waters these days.

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John Aston
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Re: The 1st of October

Post by John Aston » Sun Oct 04, 2015 8:29 am

I must admit that in 50 years of angling I have only encountered the 1 October convention recently. Pike tended to be more of a winter species for reasons unconnected with welfare. I tend only to pike fish on one stretch of river and that allows it only posts 30 September but years ago I spent many happy summer days lure fishing for pike and would happily do so again ,Odd how many anglers are happy to catch fish in spawning condition but can get terribly self righteous about summer pike (not a pop at this forum but some of the piking Taliban really drip with their own selfrighteousness)


Anyway - first session on friday afternoon produced fish of 16-17 lb and 9-10 lb. Estimates because my scales played up. Both on plug and the bigger one tried to pull my arm off

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