The Traditional Fisherman's Forum

as i only fish cane and pin,id like to think im quite proficient at a wallace cast,but the right rod for the cast is critical as i found out today,as i tend not to use the same rod all the time,i thought i would try useing a avon perfection paired up with a c815 aeril,nice looking rod,great to play a fish on,but the lazy and very soft , slow action made casting hard work,does anyone have a favorite rod for wallace casting,?i think a wizard takes some beating.

Got to be the wizard and the lucky strike for float casting. I have a 12 foot barbel rod that is bloody amazing for Wallace casting a weight with-8lb line, 1/2 oz to 1 oz weight. The wizard suits weights up to about 1/4 oz.

Chubman - I may be a traditionalist, but I'm also something of an iconoclast! I cannot understand the fixation many of the forum have with the centrepin!

To quote, as near as possible, from a certain R.Walker - ' Decide what tackle you need to catch the fish, not what fish you can catch on the tackle'. Well, I'm like that.

I tried Wallis casting on my first trip to the Avon a few centuries ago, and had to decide whether I wanted to learn to Wallis cast or fish. I chose the latter, and changed to an Ambidex. I've used fixed-spools ever since, except for fly fishing, and heavy spinning when I use a multiplier without any difficulty. For me, life is too short for learning to cast off the spool with a free-running pin.

I'm not knocking anyone who wishes to use a pin - they can be lovely reels, and casting with them is an art. In certain circumstances, I would use one too. But I'd prefer to catch fish before being an artist!

Wish you luck!

Nailbourne wrote:Chubman - I may be a traditionalist, but I'm also something of an iconoclast! I cannot understand the fixation many of the forum have with the centrepin!

To quote, as near as possible, from a certain R.Walker - ' Decide what tackle you need to catch the fish, not what fish you can catch on the tackle'. Well, I'm like that.

I tried Wallis casting on my first trip to the Avon a few centuries ago, and had to decide whether I wanted to learn to Wallis cast or fish. I chose the latter, and changed to an Ambidex. I've used fixed-spools ever since, except for fly fishing, and heavy spinning when I use a multiplier without any difficulty. For me, life is too short for learning to cast off the spool with a free-running pin.

I'm not knocking anyone who wishes to use a pin - they can be lovely reels, and casting with them is an art. In certain circumstances, I would use one too. But I'd prefer to catch fish before being an artist!

Wish you luck!

I wanted to learn to fish the Wye with a pin with proficiency, and yeah, it took about two Years and miles of tangled line before I got to the point where I am as comfortable with a pin as I am with the fixed spool and can hit most of the same spots. I haven't used a fixed spool on a river for 4 seasons now, and I get much more pleasure from using the pin. I got into centrepins before cane rods really. It was frustrating time, but I am bloody glad that I spent the time learning.

I can see where you're coming from nailbourn. I bought a pin when I was in my late teens and had the grand idea of being a master pin angler agilely flicking floats all over. I think I lasted ten minutes. I use them now after revisiting them again in my late twenties and going through the pain barrier. I don't think I prefer pin to fixed spool, I love using both.

Edit. I can't wallis cast for toffee. I use the good old three fingers of line approach. Works for me.

Not being the best Wallis caster in the world (hence the name wallys-cast and only on a good day does two out of three go where I intended it to) I do limit myself to easily achievable distances and if real distance is required I will always opt to use a fixed spool reel.
However, casting direct from the reel is not always necessary and if it's accuracy that is required, say, putting a bait tight to a nearby island especially under a overhanging branch then I find the centre-pin is king and pulling a few loops from between the rings (as per John Wilson ) and a simple underhand flick and its done.
As for suitable wallis casting rods, I find it depends on the weight being cast. Light float tackle seems to cast best on a light float rod, a 1/2 oz bomb or heavy float tackle on a Avon rod and a 1oz bomb on a carp rod seems to work about right for me.
I think the weight of the tackle has to flex the rod tip enough to flick the tackle out but too much weight puts the flex too far down the rod and the tackle will fly anywhere but where you want it to.
I do find the extra weight and slower return of cane rods helps them to cast from a centre-pin reel, far better than carbon rods.
My own favourite is my 11ft Hardy FWK Wallis Avon. It is in my humble opinion the perfect all round float rod.

Wal.

thanks for your opinions everbody,i forgot to say i tend to float fish with about a 2grm olivette which makes things a bit more difficult,on the matter of centrepins,i feel i have better control over the float and line as i tend to fish holding back on a overshot float on a fast flowing river.
many thanks, chubman.

Edit. I can't wallis cast for toffee. I use the good old three fingers of line approach. Works for me.

ditto that... I have tried Wallis casting with all the resulting tangles and frustration.... tis the good old 3 fingers for myself as well on a pin.... if I need to lob it aways I'll use one of my Mitchells

The point made above about the right rod for the job is I think key to avoiding frustration in executing the Wallis cast. The tendency to concentrate on the virtues of the reel distracts from the fundamental principle of balancing your tackle. The Wallis cast is a technique for which an holistic approach is essential to success. Certainly the reel must be free running, but not to such a great extent as others may protest. Using light tackle, I found tangles resulting from overrun even from the more sluggish of my reels to be the most frequent pitfall and more annoying than casting short. Ideally, the translation of the line from the rod tip should be matched exactly by the rotation of the drum. Smoothness and control are paramount. The problem is akin to that of bird's nesting when casting with a multiplier, as a guide the weight of the bait on its own should only just over come the resistance of the spool. The compensating drag on the better reels helps, but then again those reels that do not run so freely tend not to over-run. The other factors in this particular problem and with specific regard to the rod concern what happens between tip ring and reel. Plainly, in the interests of achieving distance the rings should not impede the flow of the line. However, while the friction of the rings is easily overcome by the momentum of the weighted cast pulling it through, the obstruction presented by the rings to the line yielded by the rotating drum is not. In short, the fewer and wider the intermediate rings the less obstruction there is and the line is easier to manage without loss of distance. The action of the rod may or may not be significant. If it is, then it is less so than the set of the rings. However, there is I believe a minimum length of rod useful to the cast: I would say 10'. Using a K Dowling Thames match reel (line guide removed) as a (bog) standard pin and a swan shot as a standard weight, with the various rods among my collection the results were equally encouraging with my Mk iv Avon copy and my Sealey Blue Matches at 12' and 14'. With more modern match rods of similar lengths with more numerous Fuji SiC guides of tiny aperture (as compared to the hard chrome high bells of the Sealeys) the results were sub-optimal to say the least. With my Falcon "The Swingtip" (8' of hollow glass and through action albeit a tad stiff and lots of fun with a fixed spool) even sans swing-tip, nothing was possible. The self loading properties of cane and fibreglass are a boon to the through flowing feel to the cast and so to does a through or middle to tip action. One common factor with the "harmonious" rods is they all have simple ring reel seats which allow the reel to be set further back to achieve a shallower angle between line and rod as it enters the butt ring. Modern rods with fixed screw down reel seats designed for use with fixed spool reels are not so accommodating, certainly that adjustment was worth the tweaking. So, I may place my reel further down the handle than others and whereas many seem to grip below the reel with thumb on the drum I favour gripping above the reel and breaking with my little finger. That actually represents a shift of a palm's width plus most of the reel's diameter, which equates to quite a difference in the moment of the rod around the fulcrum that is your elbow - held below the reel the tackle will feel heavier. Back to the Zen of casting the main point is to find a combination that is comfortable and that is determined as much by individual physique as much as anything. Anyhow, consideration of the minutiae above helped me in ironing out the snags in my casting.

Then again, if three fingers will do it in the swim your in then that's good enough.

On the what?