Perfection Roach or Roach Perfection

[Greentura]

It’s possibly been covered and I have missed it, but, there are two versions of the Perfection Roach, first just as the name says and second with the addition of ‘Mark II’. I’ve had both of those and handles were the same, blanks only varied slightly in the tip, Mk II being slightly thicker at the tip but interchangeable at the ferrule, the same guides, similar guide spacing, and then there’s another rod, the ‘Roach Perfection’. The tapers are the same as the MkII, ferrule the same, guides are that sort of ‘not low but not high’ mid bells that are hard to find now, the only difference is in the cork handle being 4” shorter and there being one extra guide on the tip section, it’s serial number dates it to 1956, and it’s a wonderful rod to use. I’d like to know more about it though, does anyone have a catalogue with both Perfection Roach and Roach Perfection listed? I’ve not seen another with the shorter handle, and it was suggested it was a special build, or that it was an accidental mistake getting the ‘Roach’ and ‘Perfection’ the wrong way round, something I would believe if it wasn’t for the other differences in its build.

[Greentura]

I’m wondering if Ashby Cut might have some information as I read he had supplied one to someone, and he’s known for well researching things ?

[Paul F]

This is what i know, although i can't claim it to be 100% correct?

Hardy catalogued the rods 'Perfection' roach from 1914-1967, i randomly checked my catalogues & super bottom fishing catalogues from 1921-1955 and that is correct.

I understand the MKII was made from 1954, and my 1955 super does not state mkII in the description.

It was known that hardy after 1954, changed the tip taper to being a little thicker, but did they make the distinction of the rods now being a MKII, or was that just a distinction through the collecting and dealer circles?

It is clear early rods the script was written roach perfection, and later rods were written perfection roach, when this change took place is a big question!

I have a rod written 'roach perfection' made in 1922, the action is very different from later rods, it is like a modified trout rod, it has a very soft through action, a very short handle, and the rings are the old style cross between a snake ring and low bells that hardy used on early coarse rods.

Was that classed as a MKI, i doubt it as the action is nothing like the later post WWII rods ive waggled.

I doubt rods were written the wrong way round, as hardy were known for their quality control, and the rod surely would have been redone?

Hardy were well known for specials if you had money, so that is a possibility, or has it been restored, and re-written?

That is the mystery of cane collecting, there are lots of things that were done, which we will never know

[Greentura]

Thanks Paul. The early guides and short handle along with ‘Roach Perfection’ would suggest an early rod, it was sold claiming 1956, the same year my first Altex was made which along with a Conquest are the reels I use with it, the tip must have been changed and it looks factory finish, apart from the tip guide which I had to replace with a clear lined tubeless Hopton style guide when I bought it, something I will be changing now I have a second rod with correct guide and a short tip, I have a new tip for that one, and it has later high bells type guides that would look better with the Hopton guide when rebuilt. Maybe a list of other peoples serial numbers and the type of build, long and short handle etc, might narrow down the date they changed.

My earlier built ‘Roach Perfection’ is H8589 - 1956
My later built ‘Perfection Roach’ is H33381 - 1960

That narrows it to between 1956 and 1960, anyone able to close the gap further ?

[Liphook]

I've never even heard of Hopton guides! Is it possible you coukd post a picture please?

[Olly]

See the following for a Hopton tip ring:- https://www.guidesnblanks.com/p/amberfin_tip_tops

Turners book - not always 100% correct - show the following regarding the dates of the rods:-

Perfection Roach - split bamboo - 2 section - 10ft/10.5ft/11ft - 1914-1966

Roach Perfection - split bamboo - 2 section - 11ft only - 1934-1955

[Wallys-Cast]

Quite rare rods in original condition.

[Liphook]

Ah yes I've seen them as 'amberfin'. Thanks Olly

[Greentura]

I've never even heard of Hopton guides! Is it possible you coukd post a picture please?

Still can’t post pictures, but it’s the tubeless type that has a wire ring around a groves glass ring, Lovely guides and when I bough a small supply from Peter Johnson of Oliver’s rods, that’s what he called them ‘tubeless Hopton style’ float rod guides. If you use Facebook I can messenger you a picture, or post it on my group ‘Traditional Angling Retro Tackle’.

[Liphook]

Thanks Greentura, see above post from Olly