Is my Sharpes Avon tip impregnated ?

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Mushy
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Is my Sharpes Avon tip impregnated ?

Post by Mushy »

Now here's the thing, I have a Sharpes Carp and Avon. Both butts are marked impregnated and are the dark colour you would expect, see photo below.

Image

The Avon was in a bit of a state, advertised as a fly rod, but I swooped in and got it at a snip, unlike the Carp where a full price was paid ! anyway the Avon was covered in varnish, and the whippings all coming adrift. So this was all stripped down only to reveal a quite light colouring of the cane. Here is a photo of the Carp and Avon tip sections.

Image

Hopefully you can see the colour difference. Now I'm wondering is this a new tip and non impregnated or maybe does the colouring change if varnish is applied. The rings all looked original you know the stand off low bells, and the ferrule is as it should be.

But well having now stripped and re-whipped on the rings should I leave it or slap on some varnish.

Any advice welcome, interestingly too the tip is thicker at the end on the Avon than the Carp, seems odd also.
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Beresford
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Re: Is my Sharpes Avon tip impregnated ?

Post by Beresford »

At a guess I'd say that's a non original tip that hasn't been impregnated that's been used to replace the original at some point with the ferrule and rings moved to the new section. With Sharpes rods I'm always wary of an impregnated rod that has been varnished overall. From the image it looks as if the butt section of the Avon has varnish on above the three signature whippings as well. As you write the taper of the Avon should be lighter than the Carp.

Do you have the serial number on the butt of your carp rod? I'm not sure if I've seen one with a gold background to the Scottie decal before so it's interesting to note and to find out when the rod was made.
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Mushy
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Re: Is my Sharpes Avon tip impregnated ?

Post by Mushy »

Hmmmm well you could be right Beresford, does anyone have some taper measurements for an Avon tip section ?

On the serial numbers:

Carp - 362 66
Avon - 44 67

Not sure what that all means, be interested to know.

Thanks for your reply Beresford much appreciated and yes the butt section was varnished too !! So whoever did this didn't really know what they were doing !!
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Beresford
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Re: Is my Sharpes Avon tip impregnated ?

Post by Beresford »

I'm fairly sure the tapers are listed on TFF.

The numbers refer to the dating system but even though I have the explanation right in front of me I can't make any sense of it at all. I've always thought that the last two numbers were the year so your carp would be the 36th rod made in Feb 1966. However, the information I have says the sequence changes in 1963.

Most of the rods I see (including mine) have 65/66/67 suffixes which I'm fairly sure puts them into the right years of manufacture. That means the dating info I have is totally wrong or I'm stupid. I cant believe that by some fluke I have the 67th and 66th rod produced in a given month of a given year. The info I have gives an example of:

311 50 as being the 50th rod made in November 1963. But I can't figure out how that sits with 362 66. Ah well…
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Match Aerial
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Re: Is my Sharpes Avon tip impregnated ?

Post by Match Aerial »

Its had a replacement tip made, the dark colouring is original Bakelite impregnation used by Sharpes.

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Beresford
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Re: Is my Sharpes Avon tip impregnated ?

Post by Beresford »

It's fascinating when you read some of the Amercian bamboo fly rod making forum posts. Impregnating cane is alive and well in the US and all sorts of mediums are used for the process including one called Nelsonite which doesn't change the colour of the cane.
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Mushy
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Re: Is my Sharpes Avon tip impregnated ?

Post by Mushy »

Ahh good it must be Nelsonite then !! No seriously I can't work this out, if its a new tip why go to the trouble of the wire whipping by the ferrule, why use the old rings, surely you'd put new ones on and why has it been finished so badly, the varnishing was dreadful !
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Nigel Rainton
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Re: Is my Sharpes Avon tip impregnated ?

Post by Nigel Rainton »

Tip gets broken. Strip the rings off to save money. Get a cheap (not Sharpes) replacement, slightly different taper. Do the job yourself, varnish to cover up the colour discrepancy.

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Re: Is my Sharpes Avon tip impregnated ?

Post by Beresford »

Based on the images and your description it most likely that the tip has been replaced and the whole job has been done to a less than ideal standard. All sorts of odd things get done to fishing rods to make them appear more valuable/desirable or just to keep them fishable.

Chapmans used to offer impregnated sections but now they are no longer really operating you might have to find a restorer who's happy to use Phenolic resin.
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Mushy
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Re: Is my Sharpes Avon tip impregnated ?

Post by Mushy »

Thanks for your replies chaps. I am not writing off the new tip yet, the cane does seem good and still alive. Thankfully I didn't burst the bank on this one and its a rod to use so all is not lost. Though I do need to check the taper to see if its a good copy of the original.

I will start a search for the info. But if anyone has an original and could take a few measurements for me I would be most grateful.
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