Traditional Big Roach Conundrum

[Gurn]

Now I know that some of you think that the river is the place to be catching roach and all else is sacrilege. I apologise to these people as I tell you the following.
In a sandpit not too far from 'Gurney Towers' reside the roach of my dreams. They are old, wiley fish and absolutely beautiful.
The problem one faces when trying to catch them is that they appear to live in a deepish area where the shortest cast is about 40-50 yards.
I have previously caught them on the feeder using a barbel rod with its finest quiver tip, hardly a purist method, but effective.
This coming winter I would like to try to catch them in a more traditional way. Is it do-able, or is this just one of those situations where a modern approach is the only sensible course.
Your suggestions on tackle and tactics would be welcome...Don't be mad at me Moley, I will take cake.

[AshbyCut]

There's a chapter called "Reservoir Roach Fishing" by Tony Miles in "Roach, The Gentle Giants" by John Bailey which may prove useful. I'm sure your local library will be able to source a copy ... or look here ...

http://www.amazon.co.uk/Roach-Gentle-Gi ... 385&sr=1-1

I could lend you a copy ... but if you didn't return it I'd have to kill you !!!

[Vole]

An Ian Heaps-style slider will probably go that far, though how you'd feed at that range beats me, unless you used another rod with a frame feeder just to feed...

I must not lose that idea, I know a place...

[Moley]

Gurn, you know me too well.

I much prefer river roach, always have, but if you were to ask me how to go about catching the roach in your local stillwater at the distances you refer to, obviously a smallish feeder with maggots as your main bait would be the answer.

The feeder I would use would be the smallest I could get away with to reach the distance in the prevailing conditions. Ditto with the rod. Personally if conditions are not too fierce I would seriously consider a Swing-tip, not fashionable I know but I have found, over the years, that they really do give superior bite indication, due in the most part because they offer less resistance to a feeding, wiley old roach. A quiver tip, no matter how fine, offers resistance to a taking fish and roach are sensitive to this. With the Swing-Tip the bites seem slower and more hittable, if you get what I mean. Remember big roach have got that way because they are the most cautious of their year group!

Length of tail will need experimenting with. Probably as a starting point 3ft then go up or down until bites become hittable. If weedy try the helicopter with a longish tail. Braid as a main line could give you an edge with regard to bites and indication as well, but I would have at least 6ft of decent mono as leader to give some cushion with playing them in. Roach bouncing around on unforgiving braid means hook pulls and no fish!

Gros Gardons (means Big Roach in French!) from the Sensas range is a nice feeder filler, along with your maggots. To eke out supplies mix the groundbait with brown crumb, about 50/50 will see you right. I prefer to mix this the night before so it is more inert as sometimes I feel a dry 'explosive' mix can put the bigger roach off....anyway up to you to experiment. You will know when you have it right.......?

Or you could go down the 'Lynch' route and use scaled down carp tactics. They work, as the results from this water show only too well BUT that is not roach fishing, as far as I am concerned....Sorry!

As for cake, I recommend Asda Madeira with Assam tea, brewed fresh if you can, to wile away the hours after the 'wiley roach!'

I hope this diatribe helps and let us all know if it works.

Mole Power!!!

[AshbyCut]

[quote="Moley"]As for cake, I recommend Asda Madeira with Assam tea, brewed fresh if you can, to wile away the hours!/quote]

May I also recommend original Soreen Malt Loaf ... sliced, and covered with lashings of real butter?

[JerryC]

I prefer river roach but there are times when the rivers are ‘not right’ during the winter months. Then I have usually found the larger still water roach can be caught on the shelf of gravel pits (they seem to patrol this area with the carp more ‘docile’ and shoaled further out) and with careful feeding during the day brought in to a rod lengths out by early afternoon. Caster over hemp – nothing fancy.

[Gurn]

Thanks fellas for your informative and like minded replies. AC, I made a decision a few years back never to lend or borrow an angling book ever again having learnt the hard way. Thanks for the heads up though.
Moley, I am glad that you picked up on my "wiley roach" comment. You probably know as well as I do that 'wiley' roach are even wilier than wily roach. :chuckle: Now where is that malt loaf, yeah AC, I had to get one.

[Moley]

Spelling never was one of my strong points, young Gurn, so relied on you to get it right!

You see when I was edumacated in the late 1950's/1960's teachers, or psycopaths as we called them, left you alone if you sat at the back quietly.....I always sat at the back, usually looking forward to elevenses, lunch or an afternoon snack, depending on the time of day. I can't remember the lessons but the lunches were not bad. I liked school dinners and always got 'seconds' off the nice dinner ladies who thought I needed 'feeding up'.

This is why I am the Fat Mole now, no doubt....that and the cake! :sun:

Mole Power!!!

[Gurn]

Well I got it wrong the first time Moley, you just quoted me.. I was actually better at french in school, than english. :chuckle:

[SeanM]

The most traditional method I can think of is the swing tip. Maybe veteran is a better description! I'd go with what Moley says and use maggots or casters on a longish tail with a 1/4 ounce bomb (or maybe 1/2 oz if you need it to make the distance). Feed groundbait by catapult with a few dead maggots or casters in each ball.

A Chapmans 500 with a threaded tip ring would make a nice rod for this method. Many 70s swing tip anglers made their own rods from fly rod blanks with 9ft being the favoured length.