The Traditional Fisherman's Forum

Firebird wrote: ↑Fri Apr 27, 2018 11:00 pm Fish will always feel the weight of the shot if it supports it. The float has no impact. True, a shot (or anything) will weigh less in water (which has the property of buoyancy, not the float), but not by so much in the case of shot because its material is quite a bit denser than water.

The float, I assume, will lift the shot as it rises.

From practical experience I would definitely say the fish do still feel the weight of the shot on the lift technique.
Next time your out in ideal conditions compare a lift with a ssg shot and one set up to take a number 4. If like me you should find the lighter rig far more succesfull.
But don't take my word for it try it for yourself plz.

The more the float lifts out of the water the more of the weight they feel, until the float lays flat, at which point they're going to feel all of the weight. But less than the actual weight due to upthrust on the shot caused by water displacement. (Things that are denser than water weight less in water)

Firebird wrote: ↑Sat Apr 28, 2018 12:09 pm

Stathamender wrote: ↑Sat Apr 28, 2018 10:41 am
The float, I assume, will lift the shot as it rises.

No, unless it has a rocket in it. The water pressure lifts the float as the shot is supported by the fish.

It's over 50 years since my O Level Physics but I assume this is a closed system which moves to equilibrium and the upward movement of the float will lift the shot through the line. Whatever I don't think it matters.

Someone maybe able to answer this better than me . But my thinking is if there is any lift from the rising of the float. It would be more efficient with the float directly above the shot. And not at an angle as you do when your tightening up the float to dot it down
Just a thought .

Surely when fish are feeding from the lake bottom they suck in the bait and lots of other bits and pieces probably the weight as well before spitting out what they don't want. This is why I think when fishing with the weight about an inch from the hook I kept missing bites because the fish felt the weight. Completely different story when the weight was moved next to the hook.

They were probably self hooking more, when the weight was next to the hook.

And before that, one can only guess that they were feeling the weight, as an explanation for you missing the bites, for there may be other reasons you don't know?

Match Aerial wrote: ↑Sat Apr 28, 2018 1:25 pm Someone maybe able to answer this better than me . But my thinking is if there is any lift from the rising of the float. It would be more efficient with the float directly above the shot. And not at an angle as you do when your tightening up the float to dot it down
Just a thought .

Given that, if the lift does have this effect, it (the lift force) is transmitted through the line so it should make no difference what the angle is.

Firebird wrote: ↑Sat Apr 28, 2018 10:57 pm The float does no lifting, it is the differential pressure from the water that does that. Same thing with a helium balloon in air. Think of a child holding a balloon. You lift the child, the balloon rises with the child. The balloon does not lift the child, you do. Easy to test that one by expt. If you find the child weighs nothing you have just discovered how to make energy...

Surely it depends on the size of the helium balloon?

Even with a party size balloon, there is a minuscule lifting effect on the child.
If the balloon were of sufficient size, it would lift the child into the air and carry it away, if you were not quick enough to grab it!
And that's not making energy, it's simply the fact that helium is lighter than air?

I fish a tench water which is full of lilies, and floats are often lost when a decent fish ploughs through the lilies.
If it's not too windy, I find the lift method is ideal, using a short length of peacock quill attached with a float rubber and one AA shot, with the shot about 6" from the hook.
As previously described, the quill is trimmed with scissors until it just bears the weight of the shot, then fished at dead depth.
I have been known to go paddling after a good session, to collect all my lost floats which have come adrift.
I am from Yorkshire.

If it's not too windy, I find the lift method is ideal, using a short length of peacock quill attached with a float rubber and one AA shot, with the shot about 6" from the hook.
As previously described, the quill is trimmed with scissors until it just bears the weight of the shot, then fished at dead depth.
I have been known to go paddling after a good session, to collect all my lost floats which have come adrift.
I am from Yorkshire.

I wish I knew where one could find decent float rubbers these days most of those available are plastic which soon splits. I won't get into the argument about lift floats being fished over depth and pulled back to cock. Increasingly what I find is that too many still waters are too weedy for fishing the lift method.